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Hi, welcome to Prideful Connections, where
we have conversation without judgment.
Today we are super excited
to have Quinn on board with us.
I met Quinn a few months ago,
maybe even longer than Matt now.
Yeah, I think over the summer.
Yeah, was over the summer.
So, and asked, we sat down and spoke
and asked Quinn to be on our board.
Alex. She agreed.
And so now, I get to have her in my life,
and she agreed to
come on this podcast with us.
So thank you so much
for being here with us.
Thank you for having me.
Excited to be here.
So I just want to start, like,
right off the bat with can you share,
what you're coming out
experience was like,
I know that you came out
a little bit later on in life.
So I just kind of want to know,
if you don't mind, to the degree
that you're comfortable,
what it was like for you
when you were younger
and when you started to feel
a little bit of gender dysphoria?
Yeah, sure.
So, yeah, I, I came out at 24,
25 years old.
First time I experienced,
I guess, gender dysphoria at home.
I mean, I was in my old house,
so I must have been four
for four years old at at,
like the youngest.
And I remember, like,
I have an older sister and I remember
wanting
to, like, try on one of her dresses
and, doing that.
And I remember, like, looking
in the mirror and looking at myself.
I remember the dress even.
It was just like dark purple.
Blue, I think, like velvet, I don't know.
It was just really pretty.
And I remember it
like the back of my hand.
And, I never was raised in a family
that, like, was like, that's wrong
or anything, you know what I mean?
But from a younger age,
I always felt like it wasn't the norm.
And so I remember a few years later,
like doing something similar
and then, like, hiding under the bed
when my mom came in or something.
You know what I mean?
Or like, putting on lipstick
and then they'd laugh, you know,
and it was just this, like,
thing, but so from, like,
a pretty
young age, I knew something was different.
I was always into both boys
and girls things.
But I could, you know, even growing up
and, like, I, I kind of wore the mask
while of being a guy, but I always felt
like something was a little bit different.
Yeah.
Because you was it in high school
or college that you were?
Did you talk about football
or was it that you did?
I played baseball.
Baseball? Yeah, I played baseball.
I played golf.
And and
to the the the.
Can you talk a little bit about that?
Because that to me was interesting.
You were right in there with, you know.
Oh, I was I was at a Sigma Chi baby.
Let's go.
It was.
Yeah, I was in the thick of it, I guess.
Because you didn't want to be trans
or because you were trying to be happy.
Yeah, I was trying to be happy
the way that I was, right?
Like, every birthday wish was I.
You know, I wish I was a girl.
Every time I walked past
like a group of girls in the hallway,
it was like, oh, my God,
look at that outfit.
So cute.
All my friends were like, yeah, look
at her or whatever that kind of stuff.
And but yeah, I always like
playing sports, all that stuff.
I was never like,
it was fun,
but I never felt like I just felt off.
And then, especially in college,
pledging the fraternity.
Oh my God, in the South,
it was an absolute nightmare.
Wow. Yeah.
So to Charleston. Yeah.
I have a question. Sure.
How visible was the trans community to you
at that time?
Like, did you know any trans people?
So I have a, a family member, my
my cousin, I guess my aunt's, husband.
So my my uncle, who married into
the family, his sister is a trans woman.
She wasn't around very often,
have a very big family,
but she was present in the family's lives.
Other than that, I don't
at least out on my dad's and mom's side.
There's no queer people, out.
There, you know? Yeah.
And we have huge families.
So at that time, when you were, like,
trying to fit in,
I mean, a lot of trans people,
we try to do that at first, right?
Did you think that it wasn't possible
for you to transition?
Well, also to like, I was, you know,
the internet was a huge, huge thing
for me.
In discovering this stuff.
But in my naive head,
when I saw trans people,
it didn't fit my narrative right of like,
oh, like, I like sports
and from what I perceive,
I'm attracted to women.
Like, it was that naive of like, oh,
I like girls, so I can't be a girl,
you know, like, okay, but just like that
very black and white
of a kind of thinking, mentality.
So, yeah, I didn't have any,
any of those influences in my life.
Until until much later into my 20s.
Like, there were the one of my roommates
in college was, a gay man, and,
yeah, I don't know, I just I felt like
I didn't fit into that group of people.
I felt like I didn't fit into either side,
you know what I mean?
Yeah.
And it kept me isolate it in my own head
for the longest time.
Were you happy?
I, I thought I was, yeah.
You know what I mean?
I mean, I'm pretty open about this.
I don't know if we've really discussed it,
but, so I'm in recovery.
I, I struggled a lot with substance
abuse for quite some time.
And that was kind of my escape for,
for the longest time.
Okay. Yeah.
You know, that's what I retreated into.
And that's what kept me, like,
level
headed in my own head, you know, from
from all the pain and suffering.
Because once I got to college
is really when I realized, okay, I'm not.
I can't fake this anymore.
And started having anxiety.
You know, I couldn't go to class.
I'd go to, like,
the fraternity rush parties and, like,
I just would have panic attacks.
I just, like, felt like an imposter.
It was just.
It was a nightmare.
And that was my purpose.
Yeah. I feel like an imposter for.
The three four. Yeah.
You know. And your family.
I know that now.
They're incredibly supportive. Yeah.
Did you grow up in a family
where you said it?
Like I often say,
I grew up in a straight world.
I didn't really know any queer,
queer people,
so just wasn't the thing in my life.
And so from that,
that was passed on to my own children.
And again, it wasn't that we had anything
against the queer community.
We just didn't.
Exactly. Yeah.
So but how was
your family with everything?
To be honest, you know, it was a lot
at first telling someone,
you know, you're trans, I remember.
So my mom reminds me of this conversation
that I don't really remember,
but I think I was like, 18,
19, I at that point was struggling
with mental health stuff.
And we were down in the Dominican
Republic.
It's like 4 a.m., I couldn't sleep,
my mom had trouble sleeping,
so we went for a walk around the,
Resort.
And I guess she asked me.
I was just struggling, and she's like,
what's going on?
Like, you know,
what's going on with you? Like.
And I guess she asked me.
She's like,
are you are you gay or are you queer?
Like, tell me, like, it's okay if you are.
And apparently my response was,
I wish it was that simple
because I was just so confused in my own
head.
Like I didn't have an answer, and
I felt like if I went one way or the other
that it was
wrong, if that makes sense.
So I just felt stuck.
Yeah, I think the for non trans people,
they live their life from the moment
they're born as themselves
and they don't have to like compare
with anybody.
But for trans people like, you know for me
it was like okay,
this is how I have to be as a guy.
Yeah.
And then I slowly realized,
no, I just have to be
Toni and I have to be what makes me happy.
Did you have that moment? Yeah.
Well what was that like. Yeah.
Well I, I remember specifically in college
like searching on the internet
like almost like or vomiting into Google.
Like I'm a guy, but I feel like
I'm trans and I like girls,
but I also like sports
and like just like completely word
vomiting.
Like, yeah,
no results should have come up.
But I typed all that in
and there were forums
full of people being like,
hey, this is me.
Does anyone else feel this way?
I was in my dorm room.
I remember crying
and I had a moment of like,
wow, okay, this is who I am.
This moment of like relief.
And then about 35 seconds later,
it was like, oh shit.
And then it was like, oh
shit,
yeah, yeah, this is what I gotta do now.
Because you can't even think that. Yeah,
you can't, you can't.
Once you realize this is who I am
and okay, you cannot not think that.
Yeah,
sometimes it could be like an oh, shit.
Yeah. It's.
And I always say, like, once a cucumber
becomes a pickle, you're always a pickle.
You know what I mean? You can't
you can't change that.
So as you talk about going down,
the rabbit hole of the internet,
I think about Cameron because that's
where he found a lot of his stuff.
And there is that sort of 9 or 10 year gap
between the two of you.
Yeah. So I think you were both probably
searching at the same time.
Oh, yeah. But,
it was
easier for Cameron because it was there.
It wasn't there when you were that age.
So it was right? Yeah. Right.
It was a lot of what I saw was still,
even at that point,
13 years old,
because I'm about to be 31 in a few days.
And so, what's that, like.
31. 30. One? I was so sure, like 25 still.
Yeah.
The magic of phase.
Oh my goodness.
The no, the, it was still
I still saw that the term transsexual
wasn't even transgender at that point,
at least from what I had seen.
You know, I'm sure it was out there, but,
Harder to find, though, back
like ten, 15 years or.
20 years ago for me.
And I'll tell you, there was nothing.
Yeah.
Nothing. Yeah.
What if most of, like,
what was the direction of, like, trans
visible people I saw was more like geared
towards people that are in the adult film
industry on the internet.
That's interesting.
The grouping of people that, like,
were presently trans on the internet.
The other person, funny enough,
was, Kim Petras.
I don't know if you guys know who
that is.
She's, she's a trans singer.
She's a pop singer. She's huge.
She did, unholy with,
Oh, yeah.
And then. And then.
Yeah.
When she was 16, they did an interview
with her, in Germany.
She was like the first
I don't know, young person.
To get, gender reassignment surgery.
And they did an article on her.
And I remember seeing her when she was 16
and I was like, oh, my God, like,
look at her.
And then, you know, fast forward now
and she's a huge icon.
And in the yeah.
Because back then
trans gender wasn't a category, right?
Yeah. It just wasn't. Nobody's seen it.
And I remember watching a Barbara Walters
special with Chaz Jennings.
Oh yeah. Yeah.
Yes. Jazz was another big one.
And I was like, Holy, holy shit.
Okay, let's let's stick with the shit
category.
Yeah, but holy shit like that.
It's possible.
It's possible to be someone
that you weren't born to be, you know?
I mean, like,
I just thought that there was an answer.
It wasn't just said that.
Yeah, and then once that once that show
was over, then it was crickets again.
Yeah.
You know, but now it's really active.
And so. So how is.
Because my journey, it's always a journey
for everybody says people and
trans people.
Has it gotten easier for you?
Do you? I know there's
a lot of misconceptions about trans
people, trans men, trans women.
How are you faced with
some of that on a daily basis still?
Yeah, I mean, it's it's
kind of weird to be part of like because
it's been five years now
and I felt like it was easier
3 or 4 years ago than it is.
Talk a little bit more about that.
I mean, I guess
as far as, like, passing goes.
Right?
Like it's a lot easier for me now
in comparison to like, the beginning.
I felt like
I stuck out like a sore thumb.
But I just feel like the community
as a whole.
Like, there wasn't all this, like,
fire on us, you know what I mean?
I mean, you see, I'm not gonna mention
anything, but, you see, like,
these interviews with politicians
talking about how they felt that
trans women
should be allowed to compete
in Miss Universe or whatever,
and that, you know, they're women
on their passports or their documentation.
Why shouldn't they be allowed to allowed
to use the women's bathroom, etc.?
And now those same people in are like,
now that that can't even be an option.
The support that was
there is no longer there.
You feel like. Right? Right.
Yeah.
Well, now there's just there's
there's a target on our backs,
for whatever reason.
And it's just odd to be part
of like 1% of the population
and be the focal point
of something like that.
It's just very strange to me.
Yeah, it's it's not.
It's not kind.
Yeah. It's it's not kind, man.
Yeah.
Especially that people are like yeah okay.
That's cool.
And now,
you know because of the political climate
has changed their mind is changing too.
Sure.
I just always hold hope.
I'm very hopeful myself.
And, you know, prior to, like,
you just said,
like when you first started researching
trends, there really wasn't much.
Right.
And we talk about this all the time.
There's so many more allies.
I mean, listen, there's my co-host
starting,
a pride event in Guilford, Connecticut.
I mean,
seriously, I mean, let's be honest,
whoever thought that was going to happen.
But look at the success of that.
How many people show up, you know, I mean,
that's that's marking change to me.
Yeah.
You know, and so you're involved with,
are you involved with the Guilford Pride
or Alex Anchor?
Yeah.
So, I'm on the board of Alex.
And it's been a few months
now, and I think we're really starting
to get the ball rolling.
This fundraiser, I think, was a huge
success based on what you've told me.
Yeah.
And, well, from being there, too,
it just felt,
It felt good, you know what I mean?
It felt good. There was a lot of,
I don't
know, just positive change
was happening in that building. And.
And it was the allies
that we're talking about. Right?
That's a room full of allies. Yeah.
And with a few people drizzled
in who we were able to
change their mind
about a certain about a few things.
And that is so important.
And one of the things
I reason why I started Alex
a few years ago,
one of the things is
because I just feel like
we need communication
and we just need to talk.
And I feel that
if you could sit in front of people
who are only learning
about the transgender community
through media
and have an actual conversation with them,
you were you or me as a parent,
we have the opportunity and possibility
of changing their mind a little bit,
or at least giving them a little bit of
an, you know, education about it.
And it's a good thing.
So but, it's very difficult right now
to be transgender.
I find, I, I, I think to be trans
female is, is even
I think either you and I spoke about this
or Cameron and I spoke about it, but
even more difficult.
Yeah.
Are you ever afraid?
Scared?
Yeah.
I think,
yeah.
More so this year than ever before.
November and December
were particularly tough months.
I think, with an administration
change and,
things being rolled out all at once.
And I think that happens
in any administration. Right.
It's kind of like a blitz fire to like,
be like, look what I'm doing, or distract
people or whatever the case may be.
I read this really interesting article
that this, social worker wrote
on it who was like,
this happens all the time.
Not this in particular
about this community, but it
this is a common thing
with an administration change.
Don't panic.
But it's hard to not panic
when it seems like most of it's
targeted at you, when you don't feel like
you're doing anything wrong.
And you're not doing anything right.
Yeah, definitely. In the record,
we're not.
Yeah, exactly.
But you know what? I'm like.
What do your parents worry about? You.
Yeah, my mom in particular.
Yeah. Yeah.
How were we?
Didn't get to that.
Yes. How were they
when they, Shocked. But.
And so I meant to,
steer in this direction
to when I said I was in recovery.
So at that point,
I had been struggling so much, and
my parents were just happy
that I was alive, you know what I mean?
It was life or death
for me for a number of years.
So it was a big thing for them.
It took a a few months
to accept and understand.
We've talked about this, of the grieving,
the loss of a son to gain
a daughter was an experience.
You know, I'm my parent's only son.
I have a half sister.
So, yeah, I don't know, it was,
it was it was great overall, but they were
just happy that I was alive and well.
And now, you know, I mean,
they can't see me any different. So.
And did the recovery
come alongside the transition.
Yeah.
So I you know it's it's hard
because I, most of the people in
my life are in a I so I go to AA
and are in recovery and
There's a mentality
in the program of like,
you need to put your recovery
before everything
else, otherwise
you're going to lose everything else.
Right?
And that's true for someone like me.
I feel like my trans,
my transition
and my recovery are very intertwined.
Kind of like a DNA helix of,
you know, one influences the other.
If I'm not being authentic
and transitioning
and being who I'm supposed to be,
I'm not going to be sober
if I'm not staying sober
or in my recovery.
In my recovery,
I'm going to miss my estrogen shots.
I'm going to miss my medication.
And I saw this. It's,
because I've worked in recovery.
And I worked at, LGBTQ focused,
recovery, place, sober living,
whatever you want to call it.
And I would see trans
women come in in particular,
who, when they were on the streets,
hadn't been taking their medication
for 3 or 4 months,
hormones, stuff like that.
And that takes a toll on you
mentally, too.
It's not just the physical stuff
that comes with all that, you know?
I mean, your hormones are
getting thrown out of whack.
So, yeah, I always
see them both as very intertwined
and linked with one another.
Interesting.
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, listen, I mean,
how strong are you to to deal with.
Both. Because it's I'm not in recovery.
But transitioning is super freaking hard.
And to be able to do that together.
But I hear what you're saying
and it makes a lot of sense.
I never thought about that.
You know
like we're.
So where do you see yourself going.
I mean listen, I think you're fantastic.
That's the first time
I'm actually having the opportunity
to really sit and talk with you.
And you're pretty powerful,
and I and I see you as a potential leader.
If you're not already a leader
in this community,
especially for the younger, population.
You know, I paved the path years ago,
and I'm, you know, I'm
looking forward to other people
coming up and doing that work.
Do you see yourself, becoming Tony.
Is about to offer you a job right.
When I retire.
Yeah, yeah. Would you feel this?
Would you? Yeah.
I mean, what's your thoughts?
I mean,
have you worked with kids or anything?
So most of my work has been in recovery.
I, I worked at a LGBTQ sober living.
And then I was,
program director,
slash house manager of a woman
sober living.
And Madison, I'm in school.
I'm. I'm headed in the fall
to, southern Connecticut for social work.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, yeah.
Just perfect. So that's great.
Yeah. So master's correct? Yes.
Yeah, yeah.
So I graduated with my, undergrad
in psych from the same, university.
And,
Yeah,
originally it was to be like, clinician.
And I'm, I'm not opposed
to still doing that, but particularly
right now, I think community practice
is where I'm going to be focused.
I feel like policy change and, stuff
like the board are like my direction
and what I want to do and, yeah.
Like, it's, it's funny
you say that because I, I used honestly
the internet again as like a huge pedestal
for my, for myself to, like,
put myself in a
place where, I could connect
with other people online.
And that was like, my connection
to my community for a long time.
I was doing some,
Just some work with, like,
a couple of trans affirming brands
and stuff like that.
And for me,
this was like what it was for me.
I remember seeing trans girls on Instagram
who I would like message
before I transitioned and be like, hey,
you're a huge inspiration to me.
All this stuff like this means so much
like just your existence, right?
And you know, a ton of them
had a ton of followers, 30,000, 40,000,
50,000 followers and some of them would
respond and be like, hey, thank you.
Like if you need any questions
answered, I'm here for you.
So for me,
like being in a similar position,
over the last few years,
like it means a lot
when like someone reaches out to me
and is says the same things,
you know what I mean?
And I'm trying to keep that going.
Yeah.
And it's so important
that, listen, I'm really I'm really busy.
But I don't care who you are.
If you message me,
I'm going to take that second.
Yeah.
That it takes to acknowledge you and say,
yeah, if you ever need anything,
let me know that that can move somebody
so forward.
It's, it's
we don't even realize it. Right?
I mean, you have helped more people
just by being authentic
than you absolutely realize.
You know, my friend said that to me, too.
He's, my best friend.
He's, queer.
And we were.
I think we were, like, out
a few years ago at, like, a a playground
or something on the swings.
And I was like, really nervous to go.
I just was feeling very dysphoric that
day, just not, you know, in my own skin.
And I was like, I don't know.
I don't want to like, you know, I
don't want kids to look at me or whatever.
And he's like, you know, how important
it is for kids to see you.
You know what I mean?
Like when kids look at you and they see
you, some of them see themselves in you.
And and he's he's brilliant kid.
I love this guy so much. Shout out Kelso.
But, you know, I just
I take that to heart now all the time.
You know what I mean?
There's still times where,
because I currently, like, work at, like,
a grocery store, and, like,
kids will look sometimes, I mean, kids
just stare at people in general,
you know what I mean? Yeah.
And now I feel way more congruent
with, like, who I am in my gender.
And I feel like I
don't get picked out of a crowd as much.
But,
I'm always, like,
scared of that, like, dreaded question
of like a kid asking their parent,
is that a boy or girl?
You know what I mean?
That's like straight,
like a cow, right? To my heart.
Like just hearing it in the background.
But sometimes, especially kids, like,
they're just curious
and they want to know and, like,
you never know who you're helping.
You know, in the short time,
I mean, I just me talking about
reading this article of Kim, Kim Petras
when she was 16.
Right.
That stuck with me.
You never you never know.
You really never. Know? No.
I, Cameron, growing up, we used to watch,
I am jazz
Jazz Jennings
together, and I don't know why I was so
into watching that.
Something about it
drew me into watching it.
And of course, for Cameron, it was that.
This sort of feels like that might be
something that that I'm dealing with. So.
But Cameron will often say
that that visibility for him
was really important to watch,
and that there was a young girl
at the time,
when she started her transition,
and then it started to be broadcast,
and that Cameron
realized that there other people
that felt the same way that he felt.
And you're not alone.
Yeah.
And and jazz obviously knows that
that's what she's doing, right?
That she's helping people.
Yeah.
But she has no idea that she's reaching
a kid in Guilford, Connecticut.
Right now.
Who is really,
really struggling every minute of the day
to, to want to be here.
So, I've got to ask you something else.
All right.
So you did facial feminization surgery.
Feminization surgery.
This cracked and went.
So you realize at 25
that you were transgender.
Was it sort of a quick transition
after that, like, all right, here I am.
Let's let's do this.
Yeah.
For me, I mean, you know,
my parents had to catch up a little bit.
Yeah.
It's been 25 years for me.
It's been 45 seconds for them.
So I had been on HRT for a few months.
At that point.
I was living in a men's sober house
in Asheville, North Carolina.
At the time when I started HRT.
Wow. By the way.
Yeah, yeah.
Toxic masculinity
at its finest in North Carolina.
Yeah.
Asheville was okay.
Yeah, I will say Asheville was all right.
And it's funny because some of those guys.
I'm still so close. So really?
That's awesome. Yeah.
Yeah. That's amazing.
Those are. My homies.
And you probably made a, like,
changed their minds, right?
Made a huge difference.
Had a few of my guy
friends say that to me before.
Yeah.
Just because they get to know you
on a closer, intimate level right there.
Most.
I don't want to say most,
but a lot of straight men's
experience with trans
people are what they see on TV.
So, you know, it's a it's
a different experience for sure.
Yeah.
So early
on was like, I think I started HRT
April 15th, of
2019.
Yeah. So,
I think I started presenting as a woman
pretty quickly after that.
Like July, I worked at,
a store,
and I told all my coworkers one by one.
So April,
May, June, July, three months into HRT.
So I was like,
oh, what an awkward signing that was.
Oh my God.
I look at old pictures and I'm like,
wow, crazy.
The changes that have happened.
Like the puberty, right? Yeah.
I'm pretty.
Yeah. Puberty looks over the top.
Make up like yeah.
We go, well, you know, we're not taught
growing up as the opposite gender
how to say in your situation,
put makeup on or stuff or how to,
you know, tie a tie or my surgery.
So it's really we do go through a second
wanted puberty this time.
Yeah. The first one I didn't want.
Second one I want.
So you have to like really learn
how to be like.
I've known a lot of trans
women who have said that to me.
Like looking at pictures
before in the makeup was like, what?
Oh God. Yeah.
Oh my God, it's it's so crazy to look at.
But for you, it was at the time
was because you wanted you
to help you present as also.
And I've heard a lot of trans people talk
about this concept of baby trans, right.
When you're in the beginning
and you're just like going over the top,
like hype for me, hyper femininity, right?
I mean, I'm six feet tall and I was like,
I need to have six inch heels
every single, you know what I mean?
Like just over the top.
Listen,
I wore a tie for the first year, for sure.
I tried that. I wore a tie everywhere
I went. Yeah, yeah. But I was like, why?
What are you doing? I don't know, I like,
I honestly, I'm not even kidding. Yeah.
Because you, you want to.
You've been waiting how many years?
For me it was 40 years or 41 years. Wow.
To be able to just be out there
in the world by yourself.
And so you do you you exaggerate it,
and then you kind of,
like, settle into yourself. Yeah. Yeah.
Right.
Like now, like,
you know, I wear sweatpants all the time.
It's like oversize this, like,
just comfy clothes more often than not.
But yeah.
And I think that's just kind
of the experience that you go through.
You're finding yourself to find. Yeah.
Yeah.
And I found too, that, like,
I don't have to be this hyper feminine
person,
especially if it doesn't fit my narrative.
You know, again, that's what
kept me so disconnected from the trans
community for so long was like,
I don't fit that narrative, so I can't be,
gender expression, gender expression
versus gender identity.
Yeah. Yes, exactly.
And that's not to say
that I don't enjoy that stuff too.
You know, like
I wore that that dress for the,
the fundraiser.
I love that dress so much.
The plaid yellow and black is beautiful.
So pretty. Yours also.
Thank you.
So pretty.
But, yeah,
I, I love to do that kind of stuff.
But, yeah, I also like to keep it chill.
Just found my groove. Right?
You said in the beginning,
you know, it's not about being a girl.
It's about being queen.
Yeah, that's not a that's what it is.
For me, it was just like a lot
of the young kids. Right?
And I don't know if you experiences
with, with cam, but you know, a
lot of the young kids will.
Parents are sending me watch is they
changed their name five times already.
Yeah. Well yeah.
Yeah. They're trying something on.
If it doesn't feel good, they're
taking it off to trying something else.
Yeah.
Same thing, you know, with
with our physical, like, kind of.
Look, we have to find out where we,
where we feel comfortable.
Yeah, but yeah, it's transitioning.
It's not a one size fits all.
But when you start realizing you're trans,
that's what you feel a lot of people
feel that I have to be this way
or that way, or I can't be.
Yeah. So I'm very happy
you found your way. Yeah.
You know, it took some time, but
I feel like it's part of the experience.
You know?
And I think
most women out there like to, to dress up
and they like to be in their comfy cozy.
Yeah. That's what that's all right.
You know what I mean.
It's also like
when I hyper analyze my look, right?
Or like how I look, I'm like,
oh, I don't look this way.
It's like, welcome to being a girl.
You know what I mean?
This is the experience, right?
So, so thinking of you, though,
growing up, you would be a prime,
but given that you weren't
or you are or you were an athlete,
you would be a prime target
at the moment, right?
So do you have any thoughts
about that playing?
If you were to play. Yeah. Sports.
Yeah, that's a good question.
I, I don't know how I feel about it,
to be completely honest with you.
I feel like,
I feel like to a certain point,
trans women should 100%
be allowed to compete in women's sports.
Especially, like,
just the way that all of this stuff
has been targeted, right?
The amount of people in the, in the NCAA
that are targeted, less than. Ten.
And I said that to someone
the other as like ten or like 10%.
That's a lot like I'm like,
no, no, no no, no, no, no,
I'm not a 510,000 less than ten.
Yeah.
But also, you know, it's funny because we
always hear about the same trans people.
They always they always reference the
same 2 or 3 because that's all there is.
You know, it's not this big number. Right.
And there's always unfairness in sports
no matter. Right.
Like so any bill you could like
and we hyper focus on like those
I remember like reading a story
of like a volleyball and trans woman.
I think she spiked it
in another girl's face or something.
So this was, this was on,
a president's speech, to Congress.
Yeah. And I spoke about that.
That happens with cis women.
And since women all the time
I mean, it happens in men's sports
with men, in men, you know what I mean?
Like, it's.
No, you're
just hyper focusing on on the one instance
where it happens
statistically it's going to happen.
And I'll tell you what makes me sad.
And hurts my heart more is when,
you know, we're always emphasizing women
and men sports.
But how about the girls, trans girls
that are playing in sports in schools now?
Yeah.
What happens?
Are they not gonna be able
to play next year with their friends?
That's what I was.
I mean, it's just it's it's really
it it's going to affect them.
You're talking about
like cis women in like, men's sports.
I'm talking about trans girls
who are now playing in
girls sports in schools
that have been before.
Right.
And now all of a sudden they can't play.
Well, I have a
I have a friend where I've just met her.
And, you know her.
I was just thinking of perhaps bringing
the young, the young moms on here.
And she, her daughter,
trans daughter is in fourth grade.
So that starts at fifth grade, right?
That's where they're trying to push it.
And I was like to think that she said
luckily her child doesn't play sports, but
but if she did, yeah,
that could change drastically.
If the child is out,
if the child is not out
and they're they're living stealth,
they're not going to know.
They're not going to know if the school.
Because I always tell parents,
don't tell them.
There's no reason for you to tell
the school that your kid is around.
There isn't. Right.
So it's just that
that's what makes me more sad.
Well, sport.
Sorry.
Sports for me
was like a big part of making friends who?
Yeah.
You know what I mean?
That's
how it's not where I'm at most of my.
Well, it's
where I'm at. About half my friends.
I don't know, you know, you
you go into, like, first grade
or second grade or third grade, you know,
and you're like or even like, I guess
at that point it would be middle school.
Right?
And it's a scary transition
from through school and middle school.
So much going on. And
you go
to a class and it's all new people
for for my school,
it was for elementary schools
that converged into one middle school.
So talk about different people, right?
The first people I gravitated towards
in my sixth grade classes were kids
I played sports with, because that's the.
One that's, you know, yeah,
that's the same in our town.
It's exact same as the old people,
because they all ended up
playing sports together
no matter what school they were at.
So once they met each other
in sixth grade, they did.
They gravitated towards those that they
knew, which were all the sports related.
I was going to ask you something else.
You're
how how are or
how were your peers after you came out?
You may have known people
15, 25 years beforehand.
Yeah.
I just I know with Cameron, virtually
those people are not in his life anymore.
It was too difficult for them. Sure.
How was it for you?
Was it for you?
Yeah. It's complicated.
I had a core group
of high school friends.
We were kind of like all of us.
All four of us were like
the chameleons of the high school.
We kind of hung out with everybody.
I told
directly, I've only told, I think one one.
I kind of lost contact
with the other two.
One has a religion that he's not like,
particularly
focused with, but,
just like belief
system is kind of similar, and,
I don't know, like I told one
and he was supportive from afar, right.
Like, I remember the last time I saw them
and I kind of in my head, I felt like
I knew it was going to be
the last time I saw it was before
my top surgery that December, before
I got to go hang out with them.
So I was still like mail passing.
And I told them, yeah.
And and then so, yeah,
like supportive from afar.
And then my best friend growing up,
it was like the joke was
we knew each other since we were zero
because my mom and his mom met
in, like, a pregnancy class.
We shared the same name.
Yeah.
Like,
is he still in your life?
And, not really. No. Yeah.
That's probably the big one for me.
That one that's,
last time I saw him was at his wedding.
He again, I sent him
a, like, a long thing and talked to him
and supportive from afar.
I guess you know what I mean.
I mean,
no one told me, like,
you know, f you, I hate you to your
face or anything like that.
But. Yeah, so
most but for the most part,
everyone's been wonderful.
And great.
Like, I've randomly connected with
a few kids from high school again online.
They're great about it.
But yeah.
No, like, there's a few,
but those, those few really hurt.
And it's not like.
I don't know, I don't know what to expect.
You know what I mean?
I can't like.
I don't know, I go back and forth.
Yeah.
Because these,
these friends were in Cameron's life
for a very long time,
and I became very close to them as well.
But then I think of
is it difficult for these friends.
Right.
Like, do I have to look at it
from their point of view?
That's what I'm trying to do.
Yeah.
It's a it's a tough one.
It's tough.
I mean, I lost friends
when I transitioned, and
I took me a long time to say, okay,
this is their choice to not be in my.
And then why would I want
anybody in my life
that's not going to honor
and respect who I am?
Yeah.
You know, if they want to do it from afar.
But I mean, it's like I always kept
and I still keep my heart and my soul open
for them to come back in.
Because
you can't push people into acceptance.
They have to walk into it. Right.
So as long as you stay your wonderful self
and you are authentic to yourself
and you surround yourself,
people in love and honor you,
sometimes those people will walk back
in. Sure.
You know, it's
just it's just a waiting game.
I'm not saying doesn't hurt,
but like you said, if somebody's suffering
and struggling,
I should say struggling with this
because they're trying to imagine what
it's like to be you and they never will.
Yeah. They never exactly.
It is a different experience to,
you know, never
go through something like that, you know?
Yeah.
And I will say, like my one friend,
my neighbor growing up,
I call, like, probably three people,
my best friend, but best friend,
I love this kid to death.
Oh, my God, I still talk to him
all the time.
We're both,
like, really into Pokemon right now.
But we have, like, these crazy inside
jokes, and, like,
I saw him over Christmas,
you know, and I see him whenever I can.
He lives in Raleigh, but,
you know, like that he never saw me
any different, you know what I mean?
He's like, okay,
he had, like, a bunch of questions.
But it was never
it never for even seeing him again.
So awkward for about 30s.
And then it was fine. Yeah.
And that's that's how I know.
Like someone like that,
you know? That's my boy.
That's my friend.
Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.
Well, Quinn, I think our time is up.
Yeah. Do you have any more questions?
I just want to know, like,
you know, like we were talking, like,
there's a lot this whole.
There's a lot of fire is going on around
us. What?
What keeps you going? What?
What brings
you joy right now in the world?
Yeah.
You know, I've got a great partner.
She's wonderful.
She's been very supportive
through a lot of this.
I was scared with dating that I wasn't
going to find somebody again because,
I don't know, it just felt like it
limited my dating pool a lot.
And being trans.
And I've been very fortunate
to have her in my life,
school and, like, getting back into, like,
getting involved is keeping me motivated,
you know what I mean?
The people that came before me
made a lot of change,
and and I'm trying to be that person, too.
And then my hobbies,
I don't know, I'm kind of a nerd.
I love being a nerd.
I felt like I couldn't be for a long time
because I felt like I was too cool,
or tried to be.
And, so again, like, I love,
I love, like, stuff
like, video games and, Pokemon.
Pokemon.
Oh my gosh, Pokemon cards
like going crazy right now.
The market is insane.
But, yeah, stuff like that.
That that keeps me,
happy and involved in the my recovery.
Not a huge thing.
So I can talk to you forever.
I know.
I I'm sorry that we have to end it.
I know.
I. Know, we'll have you back on for sure.
Yeah.
No, no, listen,
if you ever decide to be a clinical,
social worker or something like that,
let me know,
because I'll fill your practice
in about three months.
Yeah. That's awesome for sure. Absolutely.
And it was
it was an honor to be here, Sarah.
So great working with you all the time.
Tony, it was great to meet you. Yeah.
So it's a pleasure to be here.
And that email, by the way, that I love
so much, was Quinn finally.
Yeah. Quinn. Finally.
That's it? Yeah.
That was my Instagram for a long time.
So there was.
There was a girl
I saw who was unveiling Lauren.
So I was like, how can I do mine?
Quinn finally.
That's that's it everyone.
Thank you guys so much for joining us
and we hope you enjoyed this episode.
We'll see you next time.
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while empowering Lgbtq+ youth,
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