Welcome to Prideful Connections, where
we have conversations without judgment.
I am thrilled to be here again
with my co-host Tony Ferraiolo.
Hi everyone.
How are you doing?
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Tony.
How excited are you about today? Yes.
Listen, I'm super excited,
and I don't want to say anything
about the guests that we had,
but I haven't been more excited than I am
today.
Oh, boy. For sure.
All right, well, listen.
No pressure. So
I'm going to introduce this guest.
I actually need a little cheat sheet
because she's got so much stuff going on.
This is Emmy
nominated filmmaker, best selling author,
and LGBTQ plus advocate,
and there's so much more.
But her name is Fiona Dawson, and we are
thrilled to have her here with us today.
Welcome. Welcome. Thank you.
Thank you so much, Erin.
It's a pleasure and a thrill to be here.
I really appreciate the invitation.
Thank you.
Oh my God. So, so, so excited.
So I think we should just
start off, Fiona,
if you would just tell us a little bit
about your journey.
As much as you want to share, how did you
how did you get to Texas?
Okay. That's that's what I.
And you know, when you ask, you know,
how much do you want to share?
Like, you know, literally, you know,
you look so open and hold your horses.
Everybody. Here we are.
Here we go. Here we go.
It's the shows. Everything.
My accent.
I always like to start with my accent
because people hear my voice
and they put me in a box
in which I don't think I belong.
But my accent is still very British.
I grew up in the UK in a very rural
place, like in a village near a town.
The village was called
swine said the town was called Boston,
and I never imagined
that one day I was going to live
in the United States, let alone Texas.
But I, graduate.
Well, the context, I'll tell you.
I was born in 1977,
so this year I'll be 48 years strong.
So I was like, you say, my age as well,
because one of the things
I'd like to dispel ageism,
and to when I start to tell you everything
I've done, people start thinking, well,
you know, how. Old is this woman?
But anyway, I got my degree in psychology,
and in 1998, I left to go to Bangladesh,
and I volunteered in Bangladesh.
Before I had, an email address,
let alone social media.
And I taught English to indigenous peoples
about 100 miles north of capital.
And then in the last month
and a half, of my total six
and a half months in Bangladesh,
I was volunteering for the American Center
for International Labor Solidarity,
helping organize an international
conference on migrant workers.
And then at night,
I was hanging out with U.S.
Marines, drinking
Heineken and playing pool.
Now they're great. So that sounds amazing.
It was amazing.
I still think after all the things
I've done, it was still like in.
The top ten of fun times.
And so I fell in love with the U.S.
marine and, the marine and I,
went to Portugal, where he was posted,
and I carried on teaching English.
And then we were in love
and wanted to live happily ever after.
So I got married and he left the Marines
and we moved back to his home in Texas.
So. Wow. Okay.
That's how I ended up here.
But that was in the year 2000.
And four years later,
the marriage was not a marriage
that was destined to be my forever.
And I also came to identify
and realized that I was gay.
And so in oh four, came
flying out the closet as a lesbian,
was then madly in love
and committed to a woman for two years.
That relationship ended.
And then I was, like,
single for several years.
And I moved to New York,
and I realized, you know what?
The only reason I'm turning down a date
with a man,
is because I've labeled myself lesbian.
But if I'm honest with myself, gender
isn't necessarily
a barrier to my potential attraction
to someone, not to everybody.
But,
I like people of many different genders.
So I realize, oh my gosh, I'm bisexual.
There's a B, an LGBT.
So I came out as bisexual in 2012
and then, carried on my journey
as a filmmaker
and as an advocate and speaker, in 2020,
came back home to Texas
because I just feel that my soul belongs
here and I love causing good trouble
as as John Lewis said, down here in Texas
and, so yeah, today
I'm a filmmaker and an advocate.
I'm working on an unscripted TV series
explaining
the spectrum of gender and sexuality
with humor and ease.
And I also work for the Austin LGBT
Chamber of Commerce.
So yeah, that's wow.
You have quite a biography.
Wait, so where did you
live between 2012 and 2020?
Okay.
So I in, 2011, I moved to New York
to pursue my career in filmmaking.
So my last corporate job
had actually been in corporate diversity,
equity and inclusion.
And around 2010,
Oprah was launching her own network,
and she had a competition to win
your own show.
And I realized if I could do anything
with my life, it would be to host
my own show, sharing
positive stories of kindness and courage.
So I quit my corporate job to go work for
myself.
And I went to New York
because I'd never lived there.
I hadn't even visited it, actually,
I think,
but I thought, well,
I want to go on television.
So it was either going to be New York
or L.A.,
and New York
was appealing to me at the time.
So I threw all my belongings
in a 12ft U-Haul
and literally drove myself
in a U-Haul from Houston to New York.
And I'm five foot.
One as well, by the way.
So, you know, I'm not great.
Statuesque,
but that's me, like, in this deal.
So I went up to New York.
I was there for about 3 or 4 years,
and I was in Washington, D.C.
for a few years and then back to New York.
So I basically had like 11.5 in Houston,
nine total in New York and DC,
and then back to Texas in 2020.
So wow. Yeah. It's fun.
That's that's amazing.
You know, a couple weeks ago
I actually sat down on a Sunday
with a cup of coffee
and I watched Trans Military again.
I did the documentary that
you co,
you co-directed and produced, right?
Yeah. Correct. With Gabe.
So Jamie Coughlan.
Yeah. Yeah.
I'll tell you, I was just more moved now
of course, than I was
the first time I watched the documentary.
Can you talk a little bit about that?
What draw you, what drew you to do that
film but also like
what was the most memorable moments
and maybe
the moments where you're like,
oh my God, this is really challenging.
When you were doing that whole project.
Yeah, because I was right now, you know.
Yeah.
Those are deep questions. Yeah.
So I in my time in Houston,
I'd become an advocate.
And a lot of times we were doing
speaking engagements saying that LGBTQ
and in fact back then we were just saying
LGBT, LGBT people
should be able to serve in the military.
And we were trying to end Don't Ask, Don't
tell when, Don't ask and excuse me when.
Don't ask, don't tell ended.
Everyone celebrated and moved on
to marriage equality
as the issue of the day.
But in fact, we had left
trans people behind.
Still serving under a ban
because Don't Ask,
Don't Tell was about sexual orientation.
So it specifically allowed lesbian, gay
and by people to serve.
But trans people still banned,
not because of a law, but
because of outdated policy
and specifically medical policy.
And it was something that most people
weren't aware of
and didn't really put any attention to.
So when I moved to New York to go
develop my TV film career,
I had many friends who are trans
and in the military,
and I felt ashamed that I had not realized
that they would still be banned.
And so I just started
documenting their stories.
And in fact,
you know, Leyla Ireland and Logan Island,
were the two main people
that I was filming at the time.
And Logan was going off to a deployment
in Afghanistan, and,
he was seen as male and he was serving,
as male, even though his,
birth records and his medical records
had him assigned female at birth.
But he is excelling at his job, and
no one was really paying any attention.
And he wasn't lying like he was ever asked
to, like he be disclosed.
But he was serving under the ban
and serving effectively.
We knew that
this was a really powerful story.
So back then we were using Skype
and so I would Skype with him,
you know, while he was in Afghanistan.
And then just document the stories.
And then finally the New York Times
got caught wind
that I was doing this
and in so started that project, 2012.
It was early 2015.
I got contacted by the New York Times
and they said,
hey, you're still documenting
those Foreign Service members?
I'm like, yeah.
And then like, we want to film like, okay.
And they didn't want the type of show
that I wanted.
They wanted a documentary.
So I put myself behind the camera because
that story was so much more important.
And, the times
and that's when they teaming up with,
Gabe and Jamie and that production
company called Side By Side Studios.
The three of us made this short
film, Transgender at War in In Love.
And it just happened to come out
the same week,
that Caitlyn Jenner
was on the front page of Vanity Fair
and just having her,
such prominence in the media three days
before our film came out,
I think really, gave an extra boost
to the traction that our story had.
And the day after that short film
came out, the Air Force elevator
discharges of trans service members
in the Air Force to the Pentagon level.
And that was huge,
because that meant that, you know,
you'd have to go to the higher ups
to to, discharge anyone.
And that was the first time
that it ever happened.
And no one is going to waste their time,
will they?
They might do these days,
but that's a whole other story.
But, you know, to, to discharge
service members at that level.
And so it had an impact,
such tremendous impact.
And Logan and Lyla immediately
got invited to the white House
for that pride event to go meet
President Obama.
They film became Emmy nominated.
I got a champion of Change
award by the president.
The Ellen.
Ellen interviewed,
you know, Logan and Leyla.
Like just the impact of that story
was something that,
oh my God, I get emotional
just saying this out
loud right now, like I could
we could never have anticipated
how impactful that film
and that story was going to be.
And and then it continued.
And think about it.
That film came out ten years ago,
and now we're facing all of this.
Like,
I couldn't have dreamt this.
And then we carried on
and did the feature.
So tiny. You mentioned trans military.
That title is the 90 minute documentary
so Gay.
Jamie and I and the team continue
to do the feature documentary,
which came out in 2010,
and when we were filming that,
we thought it was going
to be a happy ending
and it was going to end on Logan
and Layla's wedding,
and we were in post-production
like we had like,
locked the picture of the film,
not intending to add more.
But during that time, President
Trump had come in
and then began these tweets
attacking Trump service members.
And it was just unbelievable,
mind blowing.
And so we had to like and change
the end of the film,
for that
where their lives were in jeopardy.
And of course, now in 2025 with,
I think, very similar.
Challenges, it's like,
who knew this film would be evergreen?
That's horrific.
It was just it's, you know, it's.
It's it's crazy because a lot of people,
you know, have said to me
and it's been very busy since,
January 20th.
But a lot of people said to me, well,
we've been through this before,
and I have to disagree with that because
once you when you fight for your rights
and then you, you win your rights,
now they're taking them away again.
It's a different feel. It's a different.
So are you in touch
with any of the cast members?
Oh, you are so our
I mean, have you talked to them
since all this has been happening?
Yeah. And what's their what's their take?
Yeah. Thank you for asking.
Like we were even toying
with the idea of doing a sequel.
So not just Logan
and Lyla,
but many people within Sparta, many people
within the trans military community
have become family issues.
And I'm very grateful
that I'm very tight with them still.
And, we anticipated
a new attack against trans
service members back when,
you know, Trump got elected, and,
Logan, Lyla and I were having a catch up
call late last year.
And just as friends, like
I was the person that got to marry them
like I was the efficiency
in their wedding.
I'm like, you know, we consider ourselves
siblings at this point.
That's awesome.
And, so we, we
it just came to us in conversation like,
oh my gosh, like a week.
Maybe we should do an update
because over the course
of ten years, their careers have excelled.
You know, Logan, got,
deployed over to actually station.
Sorry. Not deployed.
He got stationed over in South Korea.
He served in South Korea,
he served in United Arab Emirates
like he served in all of these places,
like he is in intelligence.
He does like top secret, squirrely stuff
that we're not allowed to talk about.
You know, he knows things that.
Like in in higher levels of security,
like he excels his job, he leads a team.
And most people in his team
that that he leads didn't even realize
that he was trans at this point
because it's been ten years.
And so both of them
have now been stationed back into Hawaii,
which is where they were when we first,
you know, where they ended the film.
Ironically,
Layla is now working for the hospital
as a civilian contractor
in the very department
that pushed her out,
like about a decade ago.
And she's like, revered
and celebrated and respected
and is like a great leader in her team.
And so that one itself
is like an interesting irony,
but like a beautiful place to have
arrived, where over the course of time
people have come to understand that,
oh, yeah, trans people exist.
They can do their jobs. We love them.
That happened.
And so we,
thought about doing a sequel to the film,
and we actually started
like documenting similarly
to how I did in the beginning on Skype.
Except this time, you know,
we're using on zoom.
So we got to the point, though, when,
you know, the executive order came out
saying that sex is two things
and it's the same agenda.
And then the new secretary of defense
was told to use
that as a basis for new policy.
And, so this policy was initiated
basically saying if you had any history
of gender dysphoria, either currently
or in the past or any medical history
of transition, then you're unfit to serve
and you need to get kicked out.
And initially I was like, there's no way
they're going to do that to Logan Island.
And then lo and behold,
Logan got put on administrative leave
because if he wasn't, he would have
had to use the female restrooms.
I like female uniform.
And so it was protecting, protecting.
And so now, of course, like he's
now one of the three lawsuits,
to basically say that, you know,
this is a discrimination
based on sex and goes against,
you know, policy.
And thankfully, this fall, like
the courts are standing strong and,
there's like preliminary injunctions
against the ban.
So, you know, Logan is back at work.
But at the end of the day,
the service members
just want to get on and do their jobs.
They want to serve.
They're not they're not here to advocate.
They're not here to necessarily,
you know, be social justice warriors.
They're simply sharing their stories
in order to indicate how wrong this is.
And, and, how it defies,
the oath that they swore to defend
and serve our country.
And I think from my observation,
if somebody who is in advocacy
in the civilian world
and uplifting service members stories,
what I see is the difference is that trans
service members have are so well
trained for this job
because they're trained to work as a team.
They're trained to like, take a mission.
They're trained to respect
their leadership, like you will find now
that, you know,
they will not go around in media on the,
in their uniforms like they have.
And so we pull back on the film
because we felt like
now is not the time to share this story,
because now is the time for them to fall
in line and, and to, so on this mission
in the best, most effective way.
And that is by,
you know, these lawsuits that are probably
going to end up at the Supreme Court.
And so we don't want to do anything
to disrupt that or, or put them in the box
of, you know, of being activists
because they're not their service members.
And I remember, I remember.
Yeah, yeah, I remember
during the documentary when Logan
gets to get his blues.
Yeah, I, I was crying, I'll be honest.
I was just like.
And to think, I mean, what a brave human
where he's been
and how he served this country.
And now they're trying to take that away.
It's just heartbreaking. Yeah.
But I just want to
mention the documentary.
Were you able to to watch?
I wasn't able to watch it,
but I did listen to a,
another podcast that you had been on.
Not so, not so long ago.
So I was very interested in hearing,
your story and all that you've done.
And, if I could just touch a little bit
on the books that you have done,
you're a bestselling author.
And your first book
I found very interesting
to hear about with your, the Father.
Yeah.
I love that part.
I just yeah.
So I talk a lot of, This is the family
friendly podcast, isn't it?
Well, yeah.
Well, yeah.
Kinda. Sorta.
Yeah. Well, you can say whatever you want.
Like. Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Yes yes yes absolutely. Yep, yep.
So you'd like me to talk about my books?
I do, yeah.
I think that I.
Yeah I will I also I'm going to come back
within the book I want to uplift
Layla as well in another way too.
And she and she's in the book.
So this is a great, transition,
for want of a better word into that.
So the so what I,
I came to realize, like, through the work,
especially with trans military,
is that a lot of people
have very direct questions
that they're too afraid to ask.
They're afraid of being told that
they're a hater or that they're stupid.
Or, you know, basically, like that
they should know better.
And yet,
I feel like I want to approach people
where with education
and like friendly forms of education,
and I want to be that safe place
where you can ask me anything,
you know, I'm not going to be
the I'm not going to get triggered by it.
I just want to give you a very direct,
answer to your question.
And so with the work with trans military,
I got to the point
where people were asking me less,
what does trans mean?
But they didn't know what cisgender meant
or cis means.
And I'm thinking, well,
if you don't know what cisgender means,
then you're likely to be cisgender.
Yeah.
True. And let me help explain that.
So I wrote a script
and turned it into animation,
explaining the difference between the word
cisgender and transgender.
And then I thought, well, is this
question, this question, this question.
So I just started writing will be scripts,
in order to make them into animation.
And then I got to the point of realizing,
you know, I could publish a book quicker
than I can find the funds.
To create 21 pieces.
Of animation.
So I made the first book
and the first title,
excuse me, the book,
the title of my first book is
All Bisexuals Just Greedy.
And it's
basically explaining the spectrum.
It's very direct.
Yeah, it's very direct answers to direct
questions people are too afraid to ask.
And the reason I talk to
they're all bisexuals, just greedy,
is in homage to my father
because when I was a teenager,
my dad said to me,
I can understand men being gay
and I can understand women being lesbians,
but I think bisexuals are just greedy.
And it didn't really I didn't think
too much of it at the time,
but I distinctly remember it.
And to this day,
dad does acknowledge that he did say this,
and I think it was
because we were watching television.
Because there were so few.
Characters and positive characters
that represented what it meant to be bi.
And so when I first came out as gay and,
I didn't
even think about the word bisexual.
And then when I later realized, oh, I'm
bisexual, that's when I became more aware
of the stigma and the stereotypes
against the bi plus community.
Even though we are the largest in numbers
amongst the lesbian, gay, bi community,
trans
people are more likely to be bisexual
or straight than they are to be gay.
And so I just felt like that, you know,
this was a thing that people ask.
And so that's the title of the first book,
and I included
some sexually explicit words in there,
including the dedication, which is meant.
To be a learning point,
as well as realizing.
That, you know, your genitals don't
necessarily dictate your gender, you know?
So, anyway, so
I just wanted to get all these words out,
and then, late 2023,
I got invited
to do a speaking engagement at NATO.
And they wanted me to do a book reading.
And I started to let me get
I what they looked at, what I said.
So I did like a safer.
Work version,
which I think is good anyway,
because I want this book to be accessible.
I want people,
you know, to to read it no matter,
where you know what position they have.
And I don't want them to be offended
if I've used a few swear words
and and expect sexually explicit words.
And so the, the second version is called,
what does that LGBTQ plus label mean?
Expression of the spectrum of gender
and sexuality with humor
and is if I could change it again,
I would add two s up here.
One of the chapters does explain to us
and then bringing it back down,
bring it back round to Layla.
I'm extremely grateful
that Layla wrote the forward in the book.
Oh, nice.
And so there's a cartoon.
It's illustrated.
Some people pick it up
and think it's a kid's book because,
you know, it looks so, you know, cartoony.
But it's it's written for anyone
who is at a place
in their life where they can talk about
sexual orientation and gender identity.
I'll leave it at that.
I'm not going to determine what age.
But Layla and I, you know,
through the years, we just celebrated
13 years of friendship, and,
she she really is a sister to me.
And I will say that, her story,
when you reflect it to Logan's story
to see how a trans woman, and especially
a trans woman of color is treated
so differently to a very masculine
white man who happens to be trans.
It's like just that, that
that two stories back to back,
really a kind of very educational,
enlightening as well.
And was definitely brought out
in the documentary,
by the way, that you definitely
would again, when when he was getting his
blues,
you can tell that she was like, wow.
Like, you know,
she couldn't be herself in that uniform.
And that broke my heart.
But you really captured
that difference in the film for sure.
Thank you.
Well,
I mean, those scenes are so personal to.
Because when,
when Logan goes shopping for his blues
and the extended scene of that scene
in the feature documentary,
I had, hopped on a plane using air
Miles, and I had no budget to hire a crew,
but we knew that he was getting his blues
for the first time.
So, myself,
one of Layla's friends, just got off fires
and videoed it on our phones.
And Layla, that very day,
I remember the day was horrific.
She was in a very bad mood,
which she acknowledged freely.
But the same day, Logan
was given permission to go
by his and buy his male uniform
to go meet President Obama.
Layla
had been told she had to cut her hair,
and she was watching her fiance say
by his blues while she was standing there
wearing a male uniform.
I mean, it was like, it's shocking.
And so when they went to go meet
President Obama, she could not
wear her uniform because if she did,
she would have had to wear a male uniform.
So that's why she's wearing
a civilian clothes and a beautiful dress.
But yeah, it's.
I wanted to, like,
take all of the stuff that I had learned
during the film process.
And I will also say this to anyone
listening who has a passion
for storytelling.
Don't hold back like we
our phones are so powerful
to document stories,
and for me, I avoid social media.
But like, you know, put it in a high frame
rate and film like this ideally,
because I know
that's how we used to film it.
But the scenes that,
some of the most heartfelt
are just filmed on the, on my side,
like when, like when Logan came back
from his deployment.
I didn't officially have a contract
with the New York Times,
so I was just a friend,
and we were filming on base
with my phone,
and we got the hug, you know?
So it's like, capture those moments
and treasure them, and you never know,
like where they're going to end up.
And then that's why, like,
I had from my own personal identity
as being bisexual
and then becoming so close, in friendship
with trans people, it helped me understand
this whole, like, spectrum of gender
and sexuality and how it's all,
you know, in different, like a mosaic.
And it's like, I want to take these things
that seem complex to people
and put them in a very binary,
direct way to understand,
because at the end of the day,
currently LGBTQ
plus people are being used
as political pawns
and it hurts people, as you know, if not,
and their lives like and
and we need to keep people safe
and we need to keep people secure
and validated and loved and,
you know, lead them through this time.
And for me, I just want to educate people
so that politicians
can't use people as political bait.
Yeah.
Like.
Clearly you're very passionate about this
and obviously a huge advocate.
What in your personal journey,
was there something specific
in your personal journey, of coming out
as, as gay and then discovering
that it was okay to be bisexual
and that you were actually bisexual?
Was there
anything of your personal journey,
that journey that just led you to say, I
you know, this is something
I just I'm feeling so passionate about?
What? I just want to get out there
and make a difference.
Yeah.
I wish that question was easier
for me to answer.
Because I have thought about this a lot,
and I, carry so much privilege
in terms of my accent, my white skin,
you know, my good teeth.
Like, you know.
All these things so I can exist in spaces
without feeling attached.
And I can speak to people
who would attack other people.
And so I feel like I have a moral
and human responsibility
to be able to use this meat sack
that I've been given
in order to advance humanity
in a positive way.
You know,
I believe strongly we're spiritual beings
having a human experience.
And so I use that term,
the meat sack, quite free
quite frequently to to say,
you know, we're all we're all connected.
You know, we're all one.
I, I was doing yoga this morning as well.
You know, and the meditation.
You know, and I just
I that is such an important part of it.
But to give more like little
like tastes of my personal journey.
And again, I write about this in the book.
When I was around 6 or 7 years old.
I cut my hair pretty sure I had it
cut short, and emulated my mom.
My mom had short hair.
I had short hair.
This is awesome photograph, I love it.
Me and my mom where I just like
how many they, My mother died in oh six.
She was only 54.
She died of pancreatic cancer. And,
I, so that's why I talk about her now
in the past tense.
But I was extremely and still remained
extremely close to her.
But I remember when I was around 6
or 7 years old
and we went to the cobbler,
like the cobbler is like the.
The shoe mender. Yeah. The shoe. Shop.
Yeah.
And I remember
taking, like, mom had some shoes
that she had to drop off at a cobbler.
And the cobbler looked down at me
and said, now then.
Sonny Jim, how are you now
calling someone Sonny Jim in England?
Like, that's like, now that little boy,
you know, and I'm like,
I looked up at this. Cobbler and I said.
I'm not a boy, I'm a girl.
And the, the cobbler felt so bad
that when.
We went back to pick up the shoes
because it was like within an hour or two,
like he had to make a bag of sweets
or candy
because he felt so bad
that I had been misgendered.
Now that's my really only.
I was misgendered
for about three years of my life.
Like my dad again says, like one day,
my, my siblings
and I, there's three of us total
and my dad and my mom, like,
we were visiting this town
where my dad grew up and,
and he was, like,
catching up with neighbors
that had known him when he was a teenager.
And he looked in the back and said, oh,
I see you've got two boys and a girl.
And my dad had two correct there.
Actually, those two girls and a boy.
But again.
Like, that's I am not trans,
I'm cisgender and I and so for me,
it's easier for me to get through that,
because I can correct people.
And when I corrected people, I was loved
and accepted and everyone apologized
like I, you know, I was told I'm
sorry when I was misgendered.
Not treated the way,
you know, many, many kids are treated now.
And so I think maybe that's
like a deep seated,
unconscious thing that might be in me.
But all my life, like,
I've just been raised in a family
to serve, like, my parents both worked
for the National Health Service,
which is,
you know, the government run health care.
You know, they
my dad is a now retired doctor.
My mom was in health care, too.
And, ever since I was a kid, they always
guided us to take care of other people.
Like we would shovel snow
for the elderly people and go buy them,
you know, bread and milk.
You know, when I was, a brownie
and then a girl guide, I used to visit,
you know, the elderly people,
you know, for about eight, nine years.
And then I went to Bangladesh
to go volunteer.
Like, it's
just something that I can't take claim
credit for because it's just who I am.
And then never imagined
that I'd end up in the United States.
But I feel like I'm here for a reason.
Like a couple of weeks ago,
I was having a catch up call with my dad,
and the first thing he said was like.
What the hell is going on in your country?
Like, yeah, don't,
do you want to come home?
You know, I know I don't consider
England home any more,
but for the first time,
I actually think I do.
I want to go back.
But I don't want to go back because
this is this is where I'm meant to be.
And I feel a call for leadership.
I feel a call to serve, as I have,
you know, since I was three years old.
You know, this is.
This is who I am.
And and I think falling into the, the,
advocacy but LGBTQ plus or
the spectrum of gender and sexuality has
just been a natural progression for me.
I think that we could all get
very overwhelmed
with the number of opportunities
we have to help people.
I would love to be environmental activist.
I would love to do all these other things,
but I feel like this is my lane,
this is my expertise.
This is where I belong.
If I'm doing this
and someone else is doing this,
and someone else is doing
all these little things, then collectively
you know, we can come together
and, and, and rise up
as a society and, and globally too,
you know.
Yeah.
So you've been I'm sure you've been busy
with everything like I have.
And, you know, Sarah has a nonprofit,
Alex Inc., and she's a mom of a trans kid.
And, you know, especially again
after the election.
It's just so hard,
for all of us who are doing the work,
how are you taking care of yourself?
How do you balance that?
To make sure that you keep your energy up?
Because we do need you, Fiona,
to keep doing what you're doing.
So, what?
What's your practice
when it comes to self-care?
Okay. Thank you.
So, we have a common analogy.
I'm sure everyone has heard this before.
Most people have, you know, put your own,
face mask on or with an air mask.
The oxygen mask, actually.
Oxygen? Yeah, but.
Put your own oxygen mask on.
And so, yes, it is extremely important.
So this is the number of ways
I take care of myself.
Number one is
I absolutely avoid social media.
I have let go of people telling me
I need to do social media
in order to advance my career.
I refuse to believe that I am dependent,
my career is dependent upon anything.
I do my best to check LinkedIn
because I do find,
you know, great connections there.
But and I'll post a few things now and
then, but I don't read, I don't scroll.
So I take the best title as much as I can
to, like,
stay in contact with people
through text messages and phone calls.
And then, some in the morning.
I have a general routine
where I'm not looking at the news.
I'm not looking at email until I have,
done some version of my practice.
It might differ every day.
But it might be going to Orange Theory
Fitness.
Love. I've got there, too. Yeah.
We have to talk about this,
Sarah. Like, yeah.
Orange theory practice.
So I alternate between orange theory and
then the next day is yoga and on and off.
Have to do the yoga as well.
Meditation.
The app insight Timer is a game changer.
Insight time is the most amazing
meditation space they have live,
practitioners like teachers,
like courses, all kinds of things.
So I make sure that I do
some version of that, like sometimes,
I might have to skip it or
I only have like five minutes.
And then other times, like this morning,
I think I spent about 90 minutes
to 2 hours, like my alarm went off,
you know, about 530.
And then I'll leave home
at 830 to go to work.
So between 530 and 830, I'm
doing some form of self-care.
And then as I'm about to leave home,
that's when I'll listen
to a quick podcast
to get the news headlines quickly.
Check the email
because you have to realize, like me,
listening to the news at 5:30 a.m.
does not change anything
but my mental health.
But between then and an 830.
So as much as anyone possibly can,
just try and avoid those things.
I'm single.
Would love to date one person.
Not picky on the gender, just.
Putting that out there.
So I don't have a partner though
to talk to you because I've noticed I.
Don't because I don't have anyone
to go home to to like, share with.
Sometimes, like.
A friend might call.
And before I know it, I'm like, you know.
Spewing up on them.
So I have amazing friends. That know that.
The owner might.
Accidentally,
like, break down into us, you know.
And so amazing friends.
And then my team that I work
with at the Austin LGBT
chamber has just been a game changer.
Like, I see I was Tina,
and we've got Colton and Amy
and me and the four of us, and, I took on
I didn't take on, like,
I gratefully and enthusiastically accepted
the job late last year
for many reasons,
but one was because as an entrepreneur,
I just really didn't
want to be working by myself anymore.
And I wanted to be in a team.
And I think the people that you work with
and the people you spend
most time with, you've got to have people
that you can work well with.
And so they're part of my self-care.
And we have a podcast as well.
And I think our podcast
is somewhat therapeutic.
And then just like just saying
mission focused
to, to myself, trying to be mindful,
and I'm very grateful.
I'm lucky because I've got a kind,
loving family as well.
So I'm not saying
things are picture perfect now.
I can also feel extreme anxiety.
But I lean into those practices
and realizing that spiritual beings
having human experience
and this anxiety in these stories,
the biological brain
making up these things
and being able to detach or observe
those stories
and realize everything right now
is okay, right?
Live in the power of the now and that.
Says, yeah, mindfulness.
Be in the moment.
I like your positiveness, Fiona.
I think that that's so important.
And I heard that a lot
when I was listening to,
the other podcasts that you are on.
And I also like I said this to Tony
because he and I talk about
when this election did happen,
people were obviously,
very down and in very, very bad spaces.
And the one thing that I said
to my son was,
and I heard you say this,
which is why I'm bringing this up,
but I know Tony feels the same way.
I did say to my son that, listen,
I don't believe for one second
that the majority of this country hates
transgender or LGBTQ.
I really, really believe that people are,
of course, looking out for themselves and
and they are going to vote
for what they feel is going to help
whatever situation they're in.
And it's hard for he's 17.
I think it's very hard
for him to understand and see that.
And, but I do think that
I, I'm not going to expect
someone to vote based upon
what's right for me.
They're going to vote based upon
what's right for them.
And that does not mean
that they have any hatred
or animosity towards my child
or the LGBTQ community.
They just aren't thinking of it.
And so I,
I was very excited to hear that from you
because I thought,
like, it's hard to find people
that are just trying to find the positive
and trying to find the good and,
and keep moving
and doing everything that you're doing
and realizing that there are good people,
there really are good people out there.
And especially you being who you are.
Like when we were in the spotlight,
when people know us
and we're sending that message to the kids
and, you know, I work with that's
all I do is work with kids.
And I keep telling them that.
What just exactly what you just said.
Like, not everybody hates you.
This country doesn't hate you.
But also we feel what we focus on.
That's just plain and simple.
So we need to start focusing on even joy.
And a lot of people
look at me and say, Joy,
how can you talk about joy
at a time like this?
No, we need to find joy
because that's resilience.
When we can be joyful in a time like now.
So I guess my next question to you
would be for our for our listeners,
how can we support your work?
What can we do to help you
and the work that you're doing?
I think that's important.
Yeah. Thank you.
Number one is to have joy, feel
joy and share love.
Like, I live in Austin and,
last weekend there was a kite festival.
Thousands of people went to the park
down the street
where I live and flew kites.
Oh, and that is helping the world.
You know, like, in addition.
So they protesting and and flying kites.
Flying kites. Yeah.
And I think that we as a collective
can all help one another
at an energetic level.
I know this is going to sound very woowoo
to some people, but I truly believe
this is like by you
finding joy in its simplest form
and experiencing that,
and like being kind to somebody,
like giving somebody eye contact
and a smile, you know,
in, in little places, like just being kind
is helping all of our collective work.
And I think that is so important.
I see the people in power at the moment
who are
attacking other people, us
a riddled with pain,
like,
can you imagine how much they love it
themselves and can't acknowledge that?
You know, I think that we're seeing
an energetic force that is, is hurting
and that is not condone
that behavior or condone that destruction
or condone the attack on the people.
But that's the way
I try and make sense of it and realize
that we can rise up
and overcome through love.
I do not agree with the messaging
of fight hate, because if I want to create
an equitable society
that I want to promote love.
And, I think that that is a shift
in the language that could happen
at a top level down in order to like,
improve people's lives at all levels.
So I think
that that would be helpful
is to realize that
while hate exists,
I think that love and joy also exists.
And I think if people can be kind
to each other in themselves
and like, work on their own self-love,
then you are collaborating to all of this
collective work.
On a practical level,
if you want to support. Me,
I don't really.
Of course we do. Yes, of course we do.
I mean, I social I get the breaking news.
Yes, yes, yes I
we would been waiting this whole time.
Okay.
Go for it.
In 2010,
I, you know, I came up with an idea
for a television show
and late last year, in fact,
it was November the 1st.
It was the week before the election.
I got an official letter from Austin PBS
to be the presenting station
for my TV show.
So we had distribution. Yay!
Congratulations.
Awesome, awesome.
Austin PBS will be the presenting station,
and we'll take it to other PBS
kids around the country.
So we're thinking about 80 to 90% of PBS
will have the show.
The title is out with Fiona,
and it's positive
stories of kindness and courage
from the LGBTQ to us, plus community.
And it's bringing people together.
So there's somebody who, is queer
identified and somebody in that family
who loves and supports but just doesn't
quite get it and needs help understanding.
So I is like your Auntie Fiona, you know,
you're female version of Mister Rogers.
You know, all time.
I know how like show is.
Like if you take Queer Eye, Mister.
Rogers and then schoolhouse
Rock with like, the animated explainers,
mix that all up and you get. That's you.
Yeah.
That's amazing.
So yeah, so that's the show.
And I think that anyone that wants to help
or watch, is like,
I guess I'll have a social media handle.
At some point.
But the website out with
the idea was there.
So I think for now, just like know
about it, know that it's coming.
We are fundraising for it.
PBS, doesn't provide the funds,
but they provide the distribution,
which is an independent filmmaker.
Getting distribution is huge.
Yeah.
Like and even before you've made it,
so I'm very confident that will have
some foundations and, individual
donors, high net worth donors.
And then we'll have a community fund,
so that if you, you want to give $1
just to give a vote to say, I want this,
I support this and that time will come.
So I think just be aware of like,
with with Fiona and feel, joy.
Be kind, be courageous in your life
and then we're all helping each other.
Yeah.
What? Fiona, you're talking 15 years ago.
You put this out there, right?
We talked about that.
You talked about putting things out
into the universe. And this is what you.
You know what happens when you're ready?
It happens when you're ready.
That's amazing.
Yeah, yeah, I've had to do a lot
of self-growth myself.
And so it happens when I'm ready.
And then it happens when the.
The world, the universe needs it to.
I don't know, I'm speaking out as well
because like back 15 years ago,
I thought people needed to be educated
on LGBTQ plus issues.
And everyone was
I know, I know, we got marriage.
We done.
And then there was a while,
you know, during
the Obama is when I'm thinking, well,
should I just give up
because everyone gets it.
Everyone knows.
I know they clearly. Don't like that.
They don't.
They don't know.
Like, oh,
and I'm going to be better at it now.
Like, I really know myself.
Like I knew myself. No,
but now I really know.
So yeah.
Let me you
this delicious dessert or television.
Yeah, I can't wait I cannot wait.
And when you have this,
we'll definitely post your website.
But when you have something else
to give us,
please give it to us,
and we'll definitely throw it out there.
But I love the kindness thing.
You know me, Fiona,
and you know I'm all about kindness.
Because kindness got your sweatshirt.
Yeah. Oh, you got my sweatshirt.
Yes, you did, but
kindness has a boomerang effect, right?
So when we're kinder to ourselves
or kinder to others,
when we're kind of others,
we're kind of story flows.
So it's happens organically.
So that's why I try to tell people,
I mean, we have choice at the moment
to like stop and pause and say, okay,
how am I going to handle the situation?
Sometimes
the power of my pause can be weeks.
If I can't say something kind of response
to what they said, I don't say anything.
Yeah.
So you're practicing kindness,
which I think is great.
What else do you have to say
to our audience about,
you know, how is that how that how is that
practice changed your life?
I mean, have you always been this?
Hey, I'm kind and have you?
Because I wasn't always this person.
You know, I was a very angry,
growing up, being abused.
I know you got my you
I think I you bought a copy of my memoir,
but I've had a really rough journey,
and a lot of people that have known me
say, say, how can you be so kind?
And how can you be so happy now?
Have you always been happy
and joyful and kind.
And which is. Great
if you have been? Yeah.
No, I know I have like I feel like
you need to ask this question to my dad.
Okay. And,
because he'll get him. On the phone.
Can you get him on?
Yeah. Like dad is.
I think dad's been interviewed like, once.
He doesn't like this.
Like my dad says, literally.
I do not know how your mother
and I created you.
Like, you are just so different.
Like today.
I am definitely very different.
Yeah.
From my from my immediate biological.
Well, from, like anyone else
I can think of in my biological family.
That, like.
Yeah, that my parents would shy away
from any attention.
I grew up in England where it's like,
keep your head down.
Don't
you know, don't make your head too big.
You gotta be able to walk through a door.
You know who do you think you are to go
have a television show?
That's just the famous people.
You're not one of those people like,
you know.
And so I have had to work through,
internal self-doubt.
I've had to increase my self-love.
I've had to I've had to do a lot of work.
I didn't just like, this is this is like
nearly 48 years in the making.
I'm proud of it.
But you were just. Why?
I'm not hiding my wrinkles.
I refuse to talk to anyone.
I'm like,
I'm working really hard to age like it.
It's like I'm proud of it.
Don't hide it like battle wounds,
but I. Did.
I grew up very lucky.
Where, you know, I, I did experience,
so, sexual assault,
but it wasn't not, but it was is a
how do I mean, how do you decide
the spectrum of sexual assault,
but I wasn't yeah,
I wasn't raised in an abusive family.
Like, I was very lucky in that my
I knew that my family
unconditionally loved me no matter what.
And, you know, they they may have had
this, British sensibility
where, you know,
you're meant to conform and fall in line.
But at the end of the day,
they let me be me.
And I remember as a child
wanting to be Princess Diana
because, I saw images of Princess Diana,
Diana visiting people on the streets,
you know, living with HIV and Aids.
And I saw her walking through landmines,
and I wanted to have
that kind of power to draw attention
to issues, to help make things better.
So I always kind of looked up to Princess
Diana, whereas at the same time,
my parents thought that she was like,
they didn't approve of Princess Diana
because they thought
she grabbed the limelight too much.
You know,
she was too much in the spotlight.
But my,
my, you
know, my dad has come to terms with this,
and I think my mother watches me now,
and I feel like she shows me signs,
like, through months
where I think she validates who I am.
And, you know,
whenever I've faced adversity,
my dad has always told me,
if you had a you're like a cat,
you somehow just land on your feet.
I don't know how you do it.
And he's written
the sweetest notes to me.
Now, where
you know who he has said that he admires,
like, my personal perseverance.
So I don't know.
Yeah. That's nice to hear from.
From your parents.
It's just nice to hear from a parent.
You know, my parents now are,
you know, totally different towards me.
Just the other day,
they're like, oh, my God.
We saw your speech at the Capitol.
We're so proud of you.
And it it hits a place in my heart
that nobody else can hit.
And when it comes from a parent.
So I can feel that for sure.
It's very, very true. I would.
So. Yeah. Go ahead.
I want to check. Yes. Please do.
It did take a long time for my dad
to get there.
And then in the same time,
it took a long time for me
to believe in myself,
in order to tell my dad.
No, I know who I am, I want,
and there's been.
It doesn't just happen once and done.
It's like many little secrets.
But one of the first times I remember is
when our film Trans Military
was playing at the BFI flare
Film Festival in London.
So it's the LGBT.
BFI Festival is a big deal.
And,
I, I went to London for the screening
and they watched the film,
and then I stood on stage and my dad,
and his wife Jenny,
and my family were all in the audience,
and dad watched me on stage
giving a Q&A and being able
to answer all of these questions around
what we're talking about.
And I sat back down next to him
and he looked at me in disbelief.
He's like, how did you do that? Like, you.
Really know your stuff, don't you. Like?
Yes, dad.
Do you know that?
So I think it's been it's
been a it's a reciprocal relationship.
And so I would say, you
know, parents like love your kids so much.
You know, please love them.
Yeah.
It doesn't matter.
Fiona, I really enjoyed this conversation
with you.
I feel like we could go on and on,
but I know that your time is valuable.
So, I thank you.
Thank. Yes, but thank you so much
for being on with us.
We really look forward
to seeing everything transpire.
Yes. And, I know Tony
and I will absolutely be watching it.
Hopefully a PBS here and Connecticut
will pick it up and be.
Able to make sure it does. Fiona.
We'll make sure it does.
Yes, but, don't be a stranger.
Reach out to us,
let us know everything that you're doing.
And I'm just so proud
to have got to know you.
So thank you.
Thank you for being with us. So
thank you, Sarah.
Thank you Tony. Thanks, everyone.
Thank you.
Yes. Thanks, Fiona.
That's it guys.
Thank you so much.
Have a great day. Bye bye.
This episode is brought to you
by Alex Incorporated.
Alex is a nonprofit organization
dedicated to creating
a safe, compassionate community
while empowering Lgbtq+ youth,
families, and allies through educational,
emotional, and financial support.
We hold annual events to raise funds
in support of these goals.
Visit Alex Inc. Org for more information.
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